Israel continues with its one sided war

The Murder Continues

Published on February 8, 2004 By zergimmi In Politics

Is Israel justified in their contiunal murder of Palestinians, and when you take away a countrie's and its peoples sovergnty, their ability to self defence, and they fight with what they have left are they rightfully considered as terrosists. Are these people fighting a civil war or are they attacking another country in an in just way. While I agree that their metods and targets are not right, are they any less wrong than the treatment metered out to them by Israel, whose only major difference is their military capability. Also who are the real agressiors in this war, lets look at the real facts, the Palestinian people, where forceably removed from their land and are still being forced to live in divided enclaves, with no mens of self defence, or ability to work or feed themselves, having a wall put through their homeland, and in a way that families and lands are being divided in a way that prohibits normal life. Then when they try to fight back they are labeled the aggressors, the enemy and terrorists, while Israel flies in without respect for civilian life and gun down suspected terrorists, and anyone in the way. One does have to ask who are the terrorists, is state terror, more right, or is it that Israel allowed to do as they like because they are one of the supposed good guys, mainly because a few other masters at HEGEMONY, support them, and when they are critised the voices are decried as being anti semitic.
I think that the truth is that Israel and its supporters are very much in the wrong and I beleive that support for Israel is very quickly declining.
I would also like to say that the distatse for tis form of state sponsored terror will eventually marginalise those who commit or support these forms of terror, as can already be seen in many countries, where governments now recoginise that their very survival, may depend on who the electorate views their behaviour.

The reality is the Palestinian people cannot fight a country which as a military power is one of the world heavyweights, even though this is disparet to their threat from others and their size, and so have very few tools to fight back, while the methodes are not to be supported or applauded, the question goes begging that , what does it take for a person to become so disenfranchised that they would be willing to give their life to fight an agressor.

What we should be learning from this is that we are creating a situation where the Palestinian people and Arabs in general will most likely spread outside of the confines of Israel and take their fight to those they view as supporters of this rogue state, one really have to question who are the real axis of evil.

Comments (Page 2)

Draginol

on Feb 08, 2004

No, what I am saying is that there is no point in discussing a complex issue with someone whose views are as rigid as yours. I'm sorry but there's plenty of people available to have discussions with. So I'm bowing out of your anti-Israel discussion because I don't feel there's anything to be gained by participating.

zergimmi

on Feb 08, 2004

I appreciate you answer Brad and do understand what you are saying.

Anthony R

on Feb 08, 2004

Look into history and you will find that there has never been an autonomous Palestine. The Palestinians have no legitimate claim to this land. In 70 A.D the Romans conquered the region and slaughtered thousands of Jews. The Romans renamed the land Palestine, in an attempt to further erase the Jews from the land. The Roman’s choose the name Palestine because it was a name inspired by the “invaders” or “Philistines.” The Philistines were dreaded and frowned upon sea people; the Romans were trying to rub salt in the wound.

The kaleidoscope that Zergimmi views the world through tells him that Israel as a brutal police state, using tanks, and helicopter gunships to crush innocent Arabs who valiantly struggle with few means, they throw stones against tanks, Zergimmi analyzes this and is under the impression that the Palestinians are brave to struggle, despite overwhelming odds. Zergimmis thesis is incorrect ,and I will explain why, The Palestinians are damned because of their cause, which is to drive Israel into the sea, or the destruction of Israel, an example of bravery in the face of overwhelming force would be the man who stood in front of a tank in Tiananmen square, a man who would rather be crushed by a tank then to be denied democracy, that was a perfect example of what is bravery in the face of a just cause, in my view.

The reality is that Israel could loose their battle for survival. Sharon seems lost as to what he is doing; Sharon released five hundred dangerous terrorists in return for one Jew. Sharon has begun to dismantle Jewish pioneering communities, expelling Jews from their settlements so that it can become a terrorist snake pit filled with hovels. Sharon is building a counter productive wall that creates a de facto Palestinian state, it also does not stop terrorist bombing.

The only solution to the conflict is simple, expulsion of the enemy. The Limbaugh doctrine holds true “Ours is a world governed by the aggressive use of force.”

jeblackstar

on Feb 08, 2004

Zerg, please feel free to educate us as to which wars Israel started. The only war that I'm aware of was the 1967 preemptive war which Israel "started" because it was about to be attacked.

Well, of course there was the massacre of the Israelis by the Romans in the time of the Maccabees. If they'd only meekly surrendered to the Empire the war never would have started.

Oh, there was also the massacre of the Israelis by Alexander the Great because, shock of shocks, they resisted when his troops came to invade.

Hmmm, yes, I'm sure we can all see the number of wars the Israelis started.

While saying this, I think the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is stupid, and at the same time insanely complex. If we could have solved the problem we would have done it by now. Neither side wants peace except that which means genocide.

Cheers

zergimmi

on Feb 08, 2004

So Anthony it was fine to move the Palestinians off their land, and create a new state called Israel, then sit back and allow the Israelis to trample over these people, just because of what happened in history a feww thousand years ago, Israel, by any measure is Brutal, it does not have legitimacy in its treatment of the Palestinians, no matter what history says, or God for that matter, the reality is The State Of Israel was created by people who imigrated to this reghion to displace people who not matter whether they had a state or not do have an uninterupted attachment to the land. I do not view the world through rose coloured glasses, I am a realist, and do acknowledge that many innocent people on both sides have died because of decisions made by leaders on both sides, however this does not legitimise the treatment of the Palestinians, and unless you can give me a good reason for other wise, then I can't see where I am on the wrong track, as for Palestinians wanting to drive Israel into the sea, making this comment is akin to saying that all Israelies would like to see Palestinians exterminated, we know that the above statement can be attributed to two extrimist groups, not the general populace, who just want a safe secure life as the rest of us do.

Nice to here from you though Anthony, I was wondering where you had gone.

JEPEL

on Feb 09, 2004

Brad: you are right saying that arafat was (is still?) a terrorist. But sharon had continusly show no respect to Palestinians, as people or as country.
Remember 1980 slaughter in Liban, remember also that he ignited the second intifada by visiting the Mosque's explanade 3 years ago. Ha has always embrass the colonisation policy.

I really don't know what to think about his recent pronouncement of leaving some colonies.

Sherye Hanson

on Feb 09, 2004

The problem with Israel is that the Israelis took land from the Arabs by force and then greated a nation. They did it because of the holocaust, the ancient promises of God to Israel that the land was theirs. Then they created a propaganda that said that the Arabs chose to leave, they weren't force to leave. The book and the movie Exodus glorified this view. However, it is false, the Israelis forced many Arabs off their land. Since then, the Arabs and the former occupants of the land have tried to get back their land by many different means. The only reason they have failed, is that Israel has the financial support of the United States government and many well off Jews from other countries.

Now the Israelis are the target of Arab terrorists and they are frightened. So consequently they destroy Palestinian houses and shoot innocent people. Because of the terrible injustice of the holocaust, they feel justified in what they did to establish the state of Israel. But two wrongs do not make a right.

Larry Kuperman

on Feb 09, 2004

I have posted a brief overview of the history of the region at http://kupe.joeuser.com/index.asp?AID=7076 including links to a number of sites. I don't think however that it will effect peoples opinions.

Sherye, one of the documents that I linked shows that there were substantial numbers of Jews in Israel before World War II. There was always a Jewish population in the area. Before and after the 1946 War of Independence, Arabs (Jordanians in fact) crossed back over to the East bank of the Jordan River from the West Bank and Jews from the Arab countries entered. Thus the population of the region became mostly Jewish.

It is interesting that the PLO invades Lebanon, tries to wipe out the Christian population and Christian Phalangists kill Palestinians and Israel gets the blame. The most that can be laid at Sharon's doorstep is that he failed to stop the fighting. Read this letter from the Lebanese Christian community to the American Congress: http://www.wlo-usa.org/Press_Release/sept_12_97.htm

Do you know that the only country in the Middle-East where the Christian population is increasing is Israel? Please visit this site: http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_current_christians.php Let me quote the following "Since Lebanon made an ill-conceived pact with the PLO in 1969, hundreds of thousands were massacred, displaced and exiled." Israel entered Lebanon ot stop the slaughter of millions of Christians at the request, nay I should say plea, of the Christian population.

There is an incredible media blitz to mislead about the goals and actions of the PLO and Islam in general. Let me quote further from The 11th-century Persian Moslem theologian, Abu-Hamid Muhammad al-Ghazzali, who said "... If a lie is the only way of obtaining a good result, it is permitted. We must lie when truth leads to unpleasant results."

jeblackstar

on Feb 09, 2004

Do you know that the only country in the Middle-East where the Christian population is increasing is Israel?

So?

xr700

on Feb 09, 2004

Zergimmi, one question: how do you expect the Jews of Israel to treat people who have for many decades blown themselves up to forward their cause?

Draginol

on Feb 11, 2004

Jeb - his pont is that clearly Christians under Israeli rule are more tolerated given that their numbers there are increasing.

jeblackstar

on Feb 11, 2004

Yes, I understood that, my point was, why does it matter if the Israelis are more tolerant towards Christians if they're still not tolerant of, say Arabs?

Cheers

jeblackstar

on Feb 11, 2004

There is an incredible media blitz to mislead about the goals and actions of the PLO and Islam in general.

Oh, and to further elucidate my point. I think it's incredibly dangerous to equate the goals of the PLO with the goals of Islam. Any person who's bothered to look at the actual tenents of Islam, and not just the brand preached by the mullahs, will know that they are not the same.

Cheers

Draginol

on Feb 11, 2004

How do you know that Israel isn't tolerant of Arabs? There are plenty of Arabs living in Israel. And beyond that, how well are jews treated in say, Syria?

jeblackstar

on Feb 11, 2004

Not arguing that point, oh and I think we can judge by their treatment of the palestinians how well they treat Arabs. And just because they treat people bad in Syria, doesn't make it right to treat "the other" badly in their country.

Cheers

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